Loft Profile On Jimmy Foley, Pirrie FC

NEWS FROM DARREN SMITH

Loft Profile on Jimmy Foley, Pirrie FC

Season Highlights 2013: 1st North Liverpool Federation Niort

A compact, very tidy set up

Can you tell me a little about yourself and how you became involved in the sport?
A lot of people when you read loft profiles say they started off with pigeons as a kid but I never, I picked it up when I was about 20/21. John & Gary Hartless got me into it as they had four or five pairs of stock birds in a shed in my back, they then bred me a team of young birds and it went from there.

What was your first club and what club/s do you fly in now?
My first and only club is the Pirrie. I’ve only ever raced in one Saturday club and 35 years down the line I’m still here.

Who were your mentors in your early years in the sport?
John Hartless put me on the right lines when I first started, I got good pigeons off him and although I wasn’t winning a lot when I first started I just enjoyed the sport in itself.

Have they taught you anything which you still practice today?
I think patience is the thing, you know. You have a good result then you have a bad result and what John’s taught me is to never get disheartened with them, don’t go changing a lot of stuff around just keep to your routine and the results will come around.

Can you tell me what preparation goes into your breeders prior to pairing up?
Probably the same as most. I’ll leave them alone throughout the winter, let them out maybe once a week during this period to get a bath and prior to pairing up, which I do around the Blackpool weekend, I’ll get them on a light feed to take any excess weight off them so that the hens can lay without any complications.

Do you fly widowhood, roundabout, natural, celibate?
I started off racing them paired up and I was reluctant at first to race widowhood as I enjoyed racing the cocks and the hens, but about ten years ago I discovered a way of racing both the cocks and the hens and this is the way it is now, total widowhood. The cocks stay in the nest box compartment and the hens are housed next door in a section that they always trap to during the week and then they are run together on a Friday. I always basket the cocks first and then after a couple of minutes basket the hens and off to the club.

Do you believe you must stick rigidly to your management routine once your racing season kicks into swing, or do you adapt it as situations arise?
If you’re racing short distances from say 70 miles I think you have to look carefully at the way you feed them. I’m a heavy feeder by nature, which probably accounts for me doing better at the longer races. When I say that I don’t mean that I feed heavier types of corn, more-so I’ll always be giving them a bit of seed or what have you and as we approach the channel I’ll then up the feed amount according to how I see it panning out.

Describe in as much detail as possible your Friday preparations, from feeding and at what time, through to basketing for the club?
I’ll put down a full feed and they can have whatever they want to eat between 8am-9am and then around 2pm I’ll give them a bit of seed which I obtain from Dennis’ corn shop. I’ll basket them about quarter past 4 to be down the club for 5pm. In terms of how long they are run together, it depends on the pigeon. You get to know through observation which cocks are happier spending a little bit longer with the hen.

The yearlings I tend not to leave too long and will always basket them first. My way of thinking is I don’t want to over excite them too much. It normally takes 2 or 3 races for the yearlings to get into their stride and I think they take their lead from the response of the older cocks to the various stimulus of a Friday.

As they return they get a light feed and I’ll leave them until I go to the club at which point I’ll feed them again with a light feed and on return, say an hour and a half later, I’ll give them a more substantial mix and I don’t think it matters which brand as there are so many good corns out there these days, it’s just what you fancy. The time the birds are allowed together upon return depends a lot on the race.

I will use a small drop of iodine in the water which will kill anything and I’ll leave that in until Sunday and that is the only thing I ever give them in terms of a supplement. I do know a couple of people who give them a very small dash of the thin household bleach and I believe it’s very good but I’ve always used the iodine.

Can you describe to me one motivational trick that usually brings about a good racing result?
I’ve tried and failed with so many ways of motivating them but I think the one that you can always rely on is just introducing a hen to a cock but again as in the case of a yearling cock, they can go over the top. As I say I’ve tried anything and everything and I can’t say a specific thing has worked with a certain bird over the years.

Do you prefer sprint racing, the channel, or do you enjoy racing at all distances?
The channel, definitely the channel. I think over the years I’ve had more placings and wins over the water and I think as I explained before that I tend to give my birds a little too much to eat early on, I get them later in the year. Now if you ask me how to race young birds I’m absolutely rubbish so if anyone’s got any tips!?

What is your criteria for getting another season at your lofts?
I don’t think I have any, I take each year as it comes. This year I’ve had a couple of wins, last year I had an exceptional season, the best season I’ve ever had since I’ve been racing pigeons and that’s over 30 odd years. I think some years it just clicks and as I explained to you before I changed me shed around to add a few more cocks and it just never worked.
I normally send around 14-15 cocks and 10 hens. What I was trying to do was pinch a few more cocks and was concentrating more on quantity than quality and it just never happened so I’ve changed my shed back to the way it was, but I feel you have to try these things and find out for yourself if it works - or not as in my case this year.

Do you stock your best racers and when do you do this, e.g. when they reach a certain age, or if they win a major race or produce a number of top prizes?
I give them a good run in the race team and I’ve just put a good 5 year old cock over to stock recently. He topped the fed in 2012 and I raced him again last year but he never won any races but he took a couple of prizes. But usually yeah if I’ve got a pigeon and he’s won a couple of races and he’s through good stock, I will put him over.

ETS trap over the cock section, hen section next door, young birds far right as the door opens

What do you prefer, a good racing cock or a hen?
I used to love racing paired and I think over the channel it was beneficial but not for sprint racing. So what I’ve done over the last 10-12 years is race what could be termed total widowhood, incorporating both cocks and hens but I will only race a certain amount of hens, say 10. We’ve got a 30 bird limit in the club so I could send the whole team out but I normally race around 24 in total.

Can you tell me your health schedule during the race season?
I’m not a medicine man but if need be I will treat them. I’ll treat them before pairing up. I’ll go down to Dennis’ and get that 3 in 1 which does the job. I may treat them again just before the channel and sometimes if I need to beforehand, you know if they pick something up, or if the birds are not right. I usually seek advice from John Hartless, you know he’s like an expert on stuff like that and can tell you what to use and when to use it, but otherwise no I don’t treat every week. I don’t have anything in the water when they come home from a race other than iodine and other than multi-vits that’s all I give.

What corns/feedstuffs do you use?
I’ve never bought corn from anywhere other than Dennis’, he has a good variety of brands there and I think most of them are as good as each other. Preference wise I’ll use Versele Laga or Marimans, I don’t think it really makes a lot of difference. I think if your birds are right and you’re feeding them right I don’t think there’s a problem.

Earlier on in the week I feed them a bit light with something like Gerry Plus and later on I’ll start introducing the widowhood mix and a bit of seed Thursday-Friday. It’s something I’ve done over the last 5 or 6 years so I’ve just stuck to what’s worked for me. I’m happy with it and the birds seem to be happy with it as well.

There might be ways of adapting what I do to perform better in the sprint races, but do you then lose out in the later races? I don’t know and I’m not prepared to try it. As we do get further out I will add a handful of breed and wean to the mix to stiffen it up. I know fliers who’ve raced through the inland programme feeding nothing but Gerry Plus and done well on it but it’s not for me.

Do you feed ad-lib or believe in feeding measured amounts?
I feed ad lib. I’ve tried feeding measured amounts and to a certain degree I do so say I feed half an ounce in the morning and three quarters of an ounce in the evening. I tend to go back and throw in some seed and a little bit more corn in. I’m probably doing both myself and the birds an injustice but I don’t think it does them any harm when it comes to the channel. I might not stand a chance at topping the fed at Hereford but I think the birds enjoy the longer races, certainly I do and I’m happy with that.

Jimmy holding 1st North Liverpool Federation Niort 2013

Is there any difference in the way you feed old and young birds when racing?
What I tend to do with the babies is if I train of a morning, I’ll train then feed them and then I’ll feed them to appetite later. Like I said earlier, I can’t get my head around young birds and the feeding regime is probably part of it, also the management. It seems to me a lot harder and I think you have to put a lot of time in with them as well which sometimes I don’t have. Give me an old bird any day!

Do you feed your cocks the same as you feed your hens, if not what are the differences?
I think based on the size of the birds, probably a bit less for the hens. It’s like feeding a heavyweight boxer, you wouldn’t give him the same as a bantamweight would you. You’ve got to work out what you need to feed and when to feed it. I work on the same principle with my hens and as we approach the channel I’ll give them as much as they want and when they want it and it seems to have worked.

I changed that a little in 2013 and I’m sorry I did. I think you try to get a balance between the two which is very hard to do but once you come across a feeding system that suits you I think you should stick to it and unfortunately in 2013 I never, so it’s back to the way I did things previously.

How much time do you devote to your pigeons both at the loft and while away from the loft?
If you spoke to me wife she’d say I spend too much time with them! I used to spend hours and hours outside, going in and out the sheds, handling them and I think what I was doing years ago was disturbing them too much. I was going in and out the lofts for no reason at all. And I think what we’re trying to do is be a bit more regimented here. If you’re going in the shed the birds have got to know what you’re going in for.

If you’re out of a morning and they get their exercise at 7am, then you’re back in the loft at 8am, 9am and 10am, the birds are wondering wbhy you’re in the loft again and it disturbs them too much so what I do now is let them have a fly of a morning, give them their feed, change the water and then come away and then I’ll only go back in of a night when I let them out again. I try to put less time into them, but more effort.

If the birds are back from a race and you’ve been up the club and then come back, why would you want to be in there when they are trying to settle down and build themselves up again? They’ve just raced home over many miles and done everything you’ve asked of them and then you’re going in disturbing them. If you work nights you don’t want someone coming upstairs and walking in the bedroom talking to you while you’re trying to get some sleep do you? That’s the way I look at it anyway.

Other than through observing your own pigeons, how do you further your knowledge?
John as I explained was probably my mentor in as much as he started me off with the pigeons and if there’s anything I need to know or I’m not sure of I will ask him. Otherwise I don’t visit any other lofts, I tend to keep myself to myself in as much as this is my bubble, this is what I like. I don’t drink so I don’t go out associating with other pigeon fliers, if there are lads come around I haven’t got a problem with that and I have a few good friends in the pigeon game whose company I do enjoy but overall I just do my own thing.

What are your aims for the future as a pigeon fancier?
Just to keep enjoying the sport for as long as I can and it’s not all about winning. I went for years and years and never won a carrot, I think the first time I topped the fed was 2005 you know so it’s not about the winning or topping the fed, it’s about enjoying the sport. From a personal point of view yeah it’s great when you get a card, or when you win but it’s also nice to someone else win.

The Pirrie is a fantastic club with some genuinely great fliers, so it is very competitive anyway and if I can compete at a certain level within me own club I’m happy with that. To me federation or combine honours come second and third.

What do you look for when introducing new stock?
I’ve had many pigeons off John & Gary over the years and I like a nice looking pigeon and that may sound stupid or slightly simplistic but I do like a pigeon that comes nice to the hand and is of a medium size. I don’t tend to go for colours, I’ve got no reds or mealies, I prefer blues, cheqs and dark chequers. But you know, I don’t think it really matters racing wise as it takes all sorts.

Bloodlines are important within the context of what you’ve got in your own shed. I had a cheq hen who recently died who was responsible for 5 x 1st prize winners and there are 2 sons of her out there which are virtually identical, so I’d always be looking for that same type of pigeon coming from that hen in the hope that they would perform similarly to their brothers but it obviously doesn’t always pan out that way.

I think we get perceptions in our head of what a certain family of pigeons are gonna do in our own hands but there are good and bad in all lines or families of pigeons whatever you want to call it and one thing I do know is that there are more bad ones than good‘uns, so bloodlines in that respect I don’t really bother with and any new introductions I make are usually pigeons I have bought in sales from local fliers such as Willo & Johnny or Teddy Davin and I’ve done really well with them.

I don’t think you can beat what’s here in this city, we’ve got some of the greatest fliers in the country and don’t get me wrong there’s loads of good fliers around but why would you want to go to outsiders when you don’t know what you’re buying and there are some cracking pigeons right here on your doorstep?

Jimmy holding 1st North Liverpool Federation Carentan 2012

How many old and young birds do you house?
Over the last 10-15 years, 15 cocks a week, 10 hens although I’ll start the season with 15 pairs for racing, I usually end up with around 20-22 as I don’t lose many and again I think it all comes down to them being looked after nutritionally. I have between 8 and 10 pairs of stock and I take 2 round from them as I only breed off selected pairs of racers. My young bird team usually numbers between 35 and 40 youngsters.

Do you train your old birds once racing starts if so, how much and why do you feel it improves your chances of victory as opposed to giving them home exercise only?
Over the last 5 or 6 years what I’ve tried to do is leave them alone from the Saturday to the Monday and let them get as much rest as possible. Come Tuesday or Wednesday if I want to throw them on a trainer, that’s what I do. They’ll go out for the first time after a race on a Sunday evening or if the weather’s not good it’ll be Monday and then I’ll try get them out twice a day.

I’m not an advocate of regular road training, I don’t train a lot. If I get in one training toss a week, I’m happy with that. If I can get between 40 minutes and an hour’s flying each time they go out, that will do me. I think with the young birds to be competitive you’ve got to be training every day which I’ve tried, but was still no good, so in future I might just breed me young birds and leave them in the shed until next year.

What has been your best achievement in the pigeon sport?
I think topping the North Liverpool Fed for the first time. I think it’s an ambition for everyone entering the sport to win a race and then once that ambition has been achieved the next thing is to do well in the fed.

What advice can you give that would help improve the management/results for a novice/new starter?
Get pigeons from a half decent flier that you know and who won’t rip you off, there are plenty of people around like that who are selling because they‘d rather pass on birds that haven‘t made the grade for them as they try to recoup their own outlays and it‘s wrong.

Seek advice from your peers and over time, experience will tell you which parts of that advice you can discard, and try and be consistent with the way you feed and when you feed.

Don’t get disheartened early on and start chopping and changing the feed and enjoy the sport for what it is, a way of unwinding and fulfilment, which as I said doesn’t always come from winning races, it’s time spent with your birds where you can forget the other stuff going on in your life.

I feel that if you’re just going in the shed and grabbing pigeons and throwing them in the basket just for the sake of sending that’s not right and I firmly believe that if you are enjoying what you’re doing and it shows, the pigeons feel that as well.

Who do you admire in the pigeon sport?
I admire the people who do the jobs in the clubs, the secretaries, the treasurers, clock setters, basket chaffers, the people who always stay to load the wagon as they are the ones showing their commitment and willingness to give to the sport and the fliers who are perhaps not as successful but who are always there helping out. More often than not these are the fliers that do the lions share of the club work.

What is it you love about the pigeon sport that keeps you involved?
The uncertainty as each new season begins and the not knowing what is around the corner. We were talking earlier about the good year I had in 2012 and a lot of expectations were on me going into Niort and then I don’t get any home over the three days of the race.

Pigeon racing is so varied and so different and we’re relying on the elements a lot of the time and on other people re the care of the birds and I think it is part and parcel of what makes us as pigeon fanciers tick. Like if I was to get a win with the young birds I’d be like were did that come from and it would gee me up and that’s what keeps me going.

It is hard, you can put a lot of time and effort in and often you don’t get a lot out, but if you persist at it I think somewhere along the line you’re gonna get what you deserve and that’s why I admire the fliers who are there week in week out, who are sending and for whatever treason are not hitting the top six to get a card, but they’re there every single week.

If it was the premier league you’d get relegated but to their immense credit they keep coming back and they get win or a crad or the pools and I get a lot out of that as I’ve been there meself and yeah there are the fliers who get the 7, 8, 9 or 10 club wins a year but we tend to forget about the fliers who are the keystone to any club who are there every single week and probably without any or little reward.

What drives you mad about the pigeon sport?
Probably most of what I’ve said above! Expectations with pigeons, you know. You‘ll have 2 or 3 good weeks and you‘re all geared up and thinking it‘ll be another good week and then what happens? Your ten minutes behind the winner and bottom of the sheet thinking oh my word what went wrong? And the worst thing you can do is start changing stuff.

We all have a bad day, we all take the wrong turn on the motorway and it does do your head in but as pigeon fliers we have no right to be in the top 4 or 6, or top the fed every week. That’s why I love it when someone comes from nowhere and tops the fed as I know what it feels like and I’m not saying it becomes blasé when you top it more than once, but there are people out there who are of the mindset I’m gonna top the fed 3 or 4 times this year and fair enough you get out what you put in, but it’s attitudes like that I don’t have time for.

What is racing in your club like?
From a personal point of view, very competitive. You can’t pinpoint any one loft as being dominant and until you’ve been down the clubhouse and the result is on paper it’s anybodies. To mme that’s a good thing as it keeps everybody on their toes, the banter is friendly and most of the lads will go down and have a drink after the race.

Who is the one to watch out for in 2014?
I wouldn’t like to single any one out as it can come back and slap you in the face and there are 6 or 7 lofts who could be premier prize winner next season. It’s been very tight with those fanciers being very consistent all season and it’s often come down to a bit of luck with trapping but that’s what racing is all about.

Do you have a message for your club-mates?
I honestly believe we have the best club in Liverpool. It’s a great club to be in and long may it continue.

The stock loft

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I’d like to thank Jimmy for giving of his time at such short notice for what was a long overdue report. It was a refreshingly open interview and I believe this shines through in the responses provided. Jimmy allowed us to handle a few pigeons and they were like peas in a pod: perfect balance, thickset across the front and very showy looking. Good lookers indeed, but with performance to back it up.

Jimmy has a great reputation as a conditioner of middle-long distance winners and anybody reading with desires of success in this field could do far worse than seek out his advice. Best of luck for 2014 Jim, I hope it is a case of normal service resumed after your alterations and that you get a few handy timers once the young bird melee begins!

By the time you are reading this, we will be into the New Year. I wish you and your families a fantastic 2014.

Thanks for reading.
Darren Smith

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Elimar January 2014