Joe Glover at Wrinehill with Les J Parkinson
Looking at the old the middle and the new.
Les, Elizabeth, Joe & Jack taken when Joe first built the brick pigeon loft
The early years. This was the original article I wrote on Joe Glover many years ago and over the years I have done one about every 10yrs so we start with the old and then move onto the new pigeons and lofts. I have known Joe for a few years now through meetings of the local 2B or Mid Cheshire Fed of which we are both members. Joe has been a lifelong fancier with his father previously having racing pigeons and both gaining success at all levels. Right from the start he met with the kind of results we are all after by winning 8 x 1st in his first season racing. Those very first birds were obtained from Harold Hulse of Winsford who was to become a very good friend of the Glover family. A lot of fanciers will no doubt remember the name of Harold Hulse as the loft manager at the Winsford lofts of the late A.H.Cornes. From these lofts Joe obtained a red cock that is still in the lofts today although his breeding days are over his life will be lived out in comfort at Mount Villa. This great racer was never sent to France as he was a brilliant land pigeon winning over £600 from various club and open races he was entered in. As well as being a good racer he was a first class breeder being sire, grandsire and g-g-sire of the loft. Such birds as Joe's good red hen winner of over £1000 and is considered as one of the best birds he has ever owned with such performances as 3 x 1st Crewe 2B Nantes, won money out of her three attempts at the R.N.L.I race. Won Cheshire open as a young bird and crossed the Channel 15 times being in the money on 14 occasions. Then on that 15th attempt Joe was to hear that she was found dead in France, shot, not the best of finishes to a great career of racing. Now I know why Joe is against racing out of France. Red hen 72J60462, won each year being clocked to win money across the Channel many times. She was 1st Christchurch, 1st Nantes and came with her cousin from Nantes in Crewe 2B to be 1st & 2nd only 7 on the day in 1978. Red cock 75 Z 46666 won several positions in the club right through, finishing up with 1st Nantes, 3rd Niort. There are the type of quality birds that are coming down from this very good red cock. Although not the best of birds in the hand being on the small side but what an eye a breeders if ever there's one. The night before my visit he flew off the platform and for that night Joe and his Uncle could not sleep as he is without any doubt the favourite. What a relief it was next day to see this 17 year old pigeon home to the lofts where he has been such a great asset. Even though Harold was a great help Joe's eyes were always drawn to the results of Denis Gleave of Middlewich and also Edmond Lunt of Pipe Gate who he rates along with the best for his consistent success across the Channel. Other fanciers who have encouraged Joe are his Uncle Joe, who is always there to lend a hand. Two other top names in the pigeon world who have also been a great help to Joe are John Masserella from the worlds No.1 breeding stud where you can obtain the best families around at the very reasonable prices. Then from another top loft you've got Horace Townrow, manager of the famous lofts of the late Frank George. One thing that sticks out in Joe's mind about the early days in the past sport was when the club had only one clock to which everyone had to run into. If that wasn't enough they also had at one time to run to a stop watch and if the birds were late the gentlemen concerned more often than not had gone to the local cricket match, how's that for the keenness at your job. Anyway down to the loft, Joe's first on was about 6'x6' with a let board across the front. The present day lofts comprise of the one 42' x 8' x 7', 6” at the front sloping to 6' 6” at the back. Trapping is no longer done by a board but through the open door for each of the 4 compartments. There are also two more lofts which house the stock birds, being 14' x 7' and 12' x 6'. All three lofts have one thing in common and that is that, they are all very well ventilated and off the ground. Between the lofts they house 30 pairs of racers and 15 pairs of stock birds of which the eye sign is first class and 50 young birds. The stock birds are paired around the 1st Feb with the racers left until March 21st as they are raced on the natural system. Joe intends to stick to this form of racing as he has been so successful over the years with both cocks and hens. To win with the birds he says that you have to have the right diet with plenty of patience to get your birds into peak fitness without over training them. Joe's birds win in the best of competition in such clubs as Crewe Premier, Wrinehill, Audlem, Crewe 2B, Middlewich 2B, Market Drayton 2B as well as the great National FC. The origin of the birds were Putman Newslad with introductions of the Horsburghs, Solaway King, Augustas Adnet and for the first time in 78 the Van Hees have been the first birds in the clock, as well as two good youngsters that were reared by Jack Robinson out of eggs from Joe's which are now known as the “Fridge cock” and “Cool customer”. Over the years many different clubs have been won by the Mount Villa lofts but the most thrilling time for Joe was when he clocked to win Crewe 2B for the third time in succession with the same hen. This same red hen also caused Joe his most disappointing moment when she was reported dead in France. To get the best out of his birds, Joe only gives them the best corn with plenty of regular exercise of which is practically always a successful combination. For YB's he likes to pair them to OB's for the longer specialist races in order to get 100%effort out of them. The OB's are raced to 523 miles with yearlings being stopped to 250 miles and YB's 200 miles. Racing them to these distances with the right training to go with the best maples & beans with 10% tares, during racing add wheat & maize for winter and like Joe you should get the results. On the subject of eye sign Joe is a believer as he says “a very good iris being clear with a good depth of colour. All my best birds have shown in my opinion a very good eye”. The cocks are preferred to be sitting 8 days and hens 14 days with some flying well to a 3 day old young bird. During 1978 in the Channel races Joe has won 4th Rennes, 1st, 2nd Nantes Crewe 2B, 2nd, 5th Rennes, 6th Nantes Audlem, 1st Angouleme Market Drayton 2B, 2nd Rennes, 4th, 7th, 8th Nantes, 2nd, 4th, 5th, 7th, 8th Niort with Wrinehill. 7Th, 9th Middlewich Open Avranches against 150 lofts but his best Channel event must be 1st Club, 1st Fed, 1st Championship Club Avranches. Trophies won this season up to YB's are Comb ave, Water Points (both 4 years in succession) Avranches Cup Nantes, Best 2B, Ave OB Ave Crewe 2B. Angouleme Cup, OB Ave Market Drayton 2B Mid Cheshire Fed Avranches & Championship Club trophies. A few tips for the novice from Joe are, when racing had finished Joe said that to get the best results out of the moult you should increase their food and add a little linseed. As to the breeding side keep to line breeding as much as possible. Always look for a good eye and strong vent along with the usual points when selecting your birds which should be from a good local fancier who has done his winning year in, year out. But most of all keep trying or you won't get anywhere you also need dedication with the right stock. Joe has been secretary for 24 years at Wrinehill that is until this year when he resigned in which time he was always at Fed meeting to represent his club. At the present time he is Vice Chairman of Market Drayton 2B & Mid Cheshire Fed, so as you can see Joe has served his clubs over the years. Joe does not agree with a lot of the liberation points and would like to see them improved to where the obstacles around are as few as possible. Also on the subject of liberation, he would like to see much more time between each one at the same point to avoid clashing. Joe's wife does not take a great deal of interest in the birds and his son has an allergy around them although he is interested which is a shame really as we need all the fanciers in the sport as we can get. Just to sum up on what I saw whilst on this visit, the birds have a good drop being up above the most of the village but going through the birds you can understand why the prizes (which are usually in the forties each year) go to these lofts. I was also impressed by the birds in the stock lofts with some direct from Van Hees that I found rather deep but had the wing to carry a big frame. Like any other top fancier you cannot keep Joe out of the prizes for very long and many more have won with these birds. Not forgetting Uncle Joe who goes almost everywhere with young Joe (too many Joe's around here!) where the birds are concerned and in constant help around the lofts. Joe has been doing house improvements for 12 months and has still got a lot to do, so he has not concentrated on his birds as he would have liked to but has still won his share.
Joe's brick loft that he no longer has pigeons in.
The half way years.
It was now nearly 30 yrs since Joe first started racing and at this time he had the odd Adent pigeon that had been in the loft for a few years and he could see that the line was a good one so he purchased 4 more birds from the gift birds sales from Adent and all were good producers the last one I obtained was in 1978 a Cheq hen Belg78-8012866 a wonderful stock hen producing many fed winners. To remember the number of winning birds that had been bred over the last 25 years from the above mentioned birds would be a near impossible task. At Nantes, 400 miles, these birds appeared to dominate with now less than 12 firsts since being introduced with one red hen winning from the race point for 3 consecutive years for which she was rewarded with the Nantes cup from Crewe 2 bird. A Cheq cock won the prestigious Middlewich 2B two years in succession and was also 1st Nantes. When Bill Carney came and looked at these Adent pigeons he was amazed at the wonderful eyes that they had the richness, quality and depth are all there to be see. The success I have enjoyed over the last 25 years with the August Adent pigeons have been years to remember. I say thank you to the late Maurice Henrotin and Colin Osman for bringing these birds over and making it possible for such as myself to purchase these fantastic pigeons “these are the pigeon: Blue cock Belg69-8063050 bred by August Adnet purchased for Joe by P Denton of London at the Old Comrades show in 1969.This cock bred a 1st prize winner in 1988 and two more in 1989 at 20 years old. What a constitution for a pigeon of this age Joe is 100% sure that he is the sire because he is always in a pen on his own and therefore no other cock could tread the hen. Over the years he had bred many club fed 2bird and open race winners, far too many to write down. This fine cock has given 21 years of wonderful sport and pleasure and has been a please to have in the loft. Cheq hen Belg78-8012866 bred by August Adnet purchased from the Old Comrades show another great stock hen which had bred 6 x 1st fed winners and is in turn responsible for many club and two bird winners. Blue hen pure Adnet 1st class racing hen clocked on many occasions including 1st Middlewich 2bird open Sartilly, 2nd club, 17th fed Dorchester 2nd club 19th fed Dorchester 3rd Weymouth twice 4th Weymouth plus many more minor prizes. Since 1984 she has also being used as a widowhood hen. She is from the old blue cock Belg69-8063050 when paired to Cheq hen Belg78-012866, red cock 82J69331 75% Adnet, a very consistent racing cock which would have won many firsts but for the fact he has been beaten by loft mates. Wins include 1st open Crewe West End Swainswick 1st club 10th Fed Rennes 1st Club 2nd Fed Cheltenham 2nd Rennes Crewe 2 bird2nd club 3rd Fed Mangotsfield 2nd Nantes 2nd Niort 3rd Club 17th Fed Wincanton 3rd Gloucester 3rd club 4th Fed Mangotsfield 3rd Rennes 3rd Wincanton 4th Club 4th Fed Mangotsfield 4th Niort 4th Cheltenham 5th Dorchester 7th Rennes Middlewich 2 bird. Other photos included with this article are not of the great Adnet family that Joe had built up; never the less they are still outstanding in their own right. Pigeons like the exceptional breeding cock fridge bred by the Ponderosa Holland 74-1165727 which is sire of 25 known different 1st prize winners and in turn responsible for over 100 first prize winners. This cock is of Vanhee lines which is also a very good family that Joe has at Mountville, a family that has produced such good pigeons Mountville leader out of 813101828 a Vanhee Janssen when paired to a daughter of Jean-Pierre, a splendid line 63959 is a pigeon one dreams about being clocked from nearly every race he goes to, wins include 12 x 1sts 8 x 2nds 5 x 3rds 2 x 4th 8 x 5ths 4 x 6th in the club 2x1sts open races 3rd open 3x1st Mid Cheshire Fed 2x2nd Fed 3rd Fed 2x4ths Fed 4x5ths Fed plus taking 5 other positions in the first 20 of Mid Cheshire Fed making a total of 55 prizes. Another of the top racers is Mountville Queen pied hen out of the 1980 bred Bucharest stock cock, which is sire to 5x1st prizewinners in 1989 while dam is a Vanhee. The cross has worked well will Queen winning 2nd club 2nd Fed Truro 2nd club Rennes 1st club 1st fed 1st championship Niort 2nd club 5th fed Niort since which time she has not been raced. Not forgetting the Geeloger blue cock 813101828 bred by Vanhee this is a fantastic stud cock breeding 9x1st prize winners in his first 2 years at stock and has continued to breed pigeons to win to 500 miles,. His total 1st prize winners is 21 including fed winners such as the 59 cock sire of 28 is a son of the famous Witoger while the dam is of the famous Geeloger pure Janssen. The other two photographs are a pied cock 80D27216 a super stock cock bred by E Marsden of Yorkshire a pure Busschaert being responsible for many winners including 83230 previously mentioned plus many other winners. Then there is 81237 which only had 5 races before going on to be a widowhood hen, wins include 1st Dorchester, 1st Worcester, 1st Cheltenham, 3rd Worchester beaten by two loft mates 2nd Worcester beaten by loft mates. Could have been five out of five for this hen who knows what a good future she could have had? I suppose this is the problem when u have such a good team, some have to stay at home. Joe’s 1989 performances include with Hankelow FC 16x1sts 12x2nds, 13x3rds 11x4ths 10x5ths 10x6ths which included 13 red cards in succession also Joe won the following trophies OB Inland Av, OB Combine, YB Av, Old and Young bird Combine Av Channel points cup Y/B KO Sartilly Trophy best single Y/B performance Sartilly medal runner up Channel Av while with the Mid Cheshire fed Grand Combine Av and Y/B Av Market Drayton 2B Y/B Trophy for the best 2 Bird Av. While I was at Joe’s we were looking through some results from 1957-1958, which highlighted the fact that the Mountville Lofts were at the top of the tree all those years ago. Since all those early results Joe’s performances have got better and better. Joe has reigned supreme along with such ace fanciers as the evergreen George Stubbs and Denis Gleave who have also dominated their respective clubs for many years. Joe has some very interesting ideas on how he should manage pigeons and says “If I was full time and could be with the pigeons all day long then I would change my ways we manage our birds to suit our job. Our work comes first and without work we cannot keep our pigeons so therefore we have to work so we have to make the pigeons second to our job. If I could race pigeons as I want to I would train more but as the price of petrol and motoring today eliminates this. We have widowhood cocks racing I have only been racing this system these last three years in 1984 we had a fantastic season with 21x1sts 27x2nds etc 2nd Open Championship of Cheshire from Rennes only beaten by one yard we were also 2nd in Crewe 2B the same day. The championship ave. was won with 4 hens at the different channel races where were the widowhood cocks in those races? There must have been hundreds of widowhood cocks in those races but our hens beat them. So if I had the time and racing right I would never go all widowhood, I would defiantly fly some hens because I am convinced that if you can manage and fly both systems you are going to get the best of both worlds. If it is not a widowhood cocks day it is going to suit the hens and vice versa so would expect to be thereabouts all the time. At the moment I am trying to do it all but I just haven’t got the time to do it as it should be done but we do crack along and shall be fighting at the end of the day. I have also been very fortunate to know some very good pigeon men like Horace Townrow from the George Webb Lofts John Massarella whom I have had some very good pigeons from. Without doubt Horace was one of the best racing men you could wish to meet as his success and achievements that he did were second to none from such places as Lerwick. He once told me that the Governors as he used to call them would say to him “now Horace when you get these pigeons tomorrow don’t clock anything in until the other lofts have timed in down the road. Horace was telling me that one day he had four thimbles ready to clock in and was waiting to get a phone call to say that they had timed in down in Wellingborough so he could time hi in. You could go to Frank George and more or less any pigeon in the loft for £40, as he didn’t ask for anything else. But now you can go to these sales and get all the Belgium pigeons completely flooding the market yet half of them are worthless. They cannot be all good, its impossible, it’s the same as a loft that breeds 40 youngsters and in your own mind you look an think now if I could take my pick of them I would probably take ten out of the 40 and sometimes you can be completely wrong as ybs can develop and be entirely different pigeons but you know after two years if you are lucky there will be 5 out of the original 40. When you think about the amount of pigeons coming into this country and are being bred solely for selling to me that just doesn’t make sense. Coming back to racing widowhood men will knock me for this, but I have my own beliefs which I feel it necessary to race hens. If you don’t race hens for a period of 10 years how are u going to know what class of hen you have got? If I can race hens up to three years old and get some good results with my particular hens those hens are then good enough to go in the stock pen and rear off. It’s all right for certain men to come along and say this will do that and that’s all right for that and that no good. They are probably right in their own way and if they cull those they think are no good then there is nothing to prove them wrong. There is only one proof in pigeon racing and that’s the basket, which will tell us whether that pigeon is good or bad. I went to vaccinate some pigeons earlier this year and this gentleman said before you vaccinate Joe will you put all those pigeons in the basket that you think are no good and all the good ones in that. I told him that if I could possibly do that then I would not keep more than 6 pigeons. It was towards the end of the middle period that Joe set about building a brick loft that was a credit to the sport in general. I say that because the lofts are situated at the top of a bank and could be seen by all passing motorists who would see pigeons in a different light than the old shed’s that were not always so well maintained. Joe raced to this loft successfully for many years.
Now we move up to date.
Joe's current racing loft
Most of the best results over the years and the general systems that Joe has used have never really changed over the years so this is what Joe had to say to bring us up to date. Joe was saying that he has now been racing pigeons for 64yrs and did admit that it is getting harder to win all the time, he said when he was younger it was never a problem but to go down and do the same nowadays is hard work. Having said that in 2015 he won 13 x 1sts but added that his best season was in 93 when he won 48 x 1sts but did race in more clubs at the time. We are now up to the modern racing and as the years passed Joe decided that the big brick loft was more than he wanted to handle so he reverted back to racing in the smaller wooden lofts that were to the right of the brick loft and had stood there for quite some time. Joe has tried to make racing easier by bringing in the Jan Theelans from the Ian Axe Lofts for the distance racing and within 2yrs they started to win over the channel which is good going as distance pigeons usually take a bit longer because of age. The only specialist race that Joe now competes in is the Midland Continental where he is doing well with some good results. Niort is a strong race for Joe because he normally gets them and with having the new Theelan stock they are doing even better from this 470ml race. Joe said that he is still training but not as much as he used to because distance pigeons do not need the daily run down the road as with the shorter distance racers. The training is scheduled for the spell coming up to those selected races therefore no need for endless weeks training. In 2015 Joe only reared 8 young birds because he had such a good strong team of old birds that were going well so saw no point in overcrowding. These 8 were sent to 2 races for training as a bit of experience and Joe still ended up highest prize winner, just with the old birds. With thoughts on channel racing this also gave him a chance to allow for a bit more age on the pigeons and a proper chance to prove themselves at the distances that they were bred for. For this coming season there are 27prs that will be raced on the roundabout, this system is used because Joe does like to race then hens that have done so well for him over the years.
Stock loft
There are also 8prs of stock a much reduced team on what they used to be when Joe was racing to win everywhere he could. The feeding system has hardly changed over the years with the mixes very much the same but he has changed brands. He still adds a very small amount of layers pellets to the mix for both breeding and racing abut not for the rest of the year. Gemthrepax is also used on the corn and what Joe does is add it to the corn that he is going to use in that week on the Monday so that it is dry when given to the pigeons each day. Joe is still enjoying the pigeons as much as he ever has even though he was saying competing is getting harder. We had quite a discussion about racing locally and Joe had some strong views that I do agree with him but as I am no longer races these issues do not affect me.
Inside the racing loft - Inside the stock loft
I handled a cracking blue hen that has not been in the loft since it was a young bird so Joe is wondering where it has been. One thing is for sure it has not been out because she is in real good condition, Joe did contact the RPRA to make sure that she was still registered to him and she is. I have been to Joe’s many times over the last 40yrs and he has always commented about how the cold North East winds get to you coming over the fields behind the lofts. Joe went on to say that when he was at home racing with his dad he learnt a good lesson early on about east winds. Joe got up one morning to find a note left by his dad who had gone to work; the note was telling him not to take the pigeons training. It was a beautiful morning and Joe was looking at the blue sky and even said to his mother that the weather was good for a toss so she told he to do what he thought was the best thing to do. No more to do Joe basketed the pigeons, jumped on his bike and took them to the railway station to be tossed at Wolverhampton which I would guess is about 30mls. Joe sat there waiting and by the time he went to work only the black cock had turned up. Off to work Joe went and met his dad who had just finished work, he told him what he had done and that the black cock was the only one back, a good lesson learned. These are the winds that the animals don’t like and I certainly didn’t like it on this visit and I must add it is the first time that I have understood what Joe was referring to, must be my age. Even Elizabeth got back in the car when she had taken some photos. Even though Joe looked well he was saying that he cannot do what he used to do with the pigeons but they looked well enough to me. He went on to say that as long as he can still manage the pigeons he will carry on racing but when he cannot give them 100% he will be looking at them differently. I don’t think there is going to be much change for a while.
Joe Glover and Les J Parkinson
